http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ Hawaii Hoops - Forum Tag: Mid Pacific en Wed, 07 Jan 2009 13:39:08 +0000 http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-294 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 09:47:17 +0000 Shaka 294@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>if i were a little younger, a little lighter, and had no kids, i would consider applying. as you move up in the ranks, there is some serious money that can be made. many moons ago, when i was in college, i officiated intramurals. they paid me $14/game. sometimes i would do 5 games in a row. serious beer money! i totally understand how they are judgement calls. but it also amazes me how everyone in the stands can see the play one way, and the ref sees the same play another way! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-293 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 09:35:19 +0000 hoopsitiz 293@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Neither. Just an obedient parent. I don't have the balls to become a ref, so it is what it is. I talk to them later if I really think it was a bad call. But then I let it go because like I said, they are judgement calls. Hows about you Shaka, wanna apply? </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-291 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:53:41 +0000 Shaka 291@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>yeahhh! beers would be good!</p> <p>wow hoopsitiz...who are you matt hoe or clayton tang??? </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-290 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:48:49 +0000 hoopsitiz 290@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Remember now, referring are judgement calls. Most times we don't agree but thats the way it goes. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-289 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:47:52 +0000 BasketballJones 289@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Shaka...why all the negative energy? I think we should have some beers today. Loosen up a little... </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-287 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:43:20 +0000 Shaka 287@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>yeah, sometimes i wanna choke the refs neck! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-284 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:02:49 +0000 BasketballJones 284@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Well said 69...I agree. Wholeheartedly.</p> <p>Kaunahoakalani - I don't disagree with you on the Sharks coach that he is a great guy. In my posts, matter of fact, I only talked about his coaching style. I know him personally and I consider him a straight up kind of guy. Your post pretty much defended all of that. </p> <p>But what I, and some of the other posters were alluding to, was the fact that he is good at putting good talent together instead of developing players like some other club coaches out there. Jeff Won has had basically the same core of players since they were 10 years old. The Warriors club ball team has been together since they were 10 years old. Soriyama's team may not have been together as long but he basically coaches the Farrington squad for the sake of developing that program's basketball players. Scotty Nobriga out of Kailua basically coaches kids out of the Kailua/Waiamanalo area and has had the same boys for many, many years. I know as fact that the Sharks coach would add kids to his Vegas travelling squad just a few weeks prior to his trip to "strengthen" his team. As far as morale, what does that do to the players that have been practicing for months and sometimes a year with the team? All of a sudden the coach brings in someone last minute and takes my playing time for the sake of some W's...which Auntie J has noted that the Sharks has taken 3rd place in Vegas. Very impressive, but she doesn't know that they play in the B division and not the Open Division or even A division? Personally, if you are going to fly up to play in a national tournament, and you are going up with apparently the "best" assembled team, why don't you want to play in the upper division and waste your time playing lower teams? </p> <p>Club basketball is all about developing your basketball skills during the off-season, which is basically when championships are decided, yada yada yada...you know the ol' cliche. Kaunahoakalani has made excellent points about parent/child relationship and their development in their chosen sport. I had to laugh a bit about the part you mentioned how you are guilty of going crazy...I felt the same way too once! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-281 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 01:46:22 +0000 Kaunahoakalani 281@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>A couple observations: </p> <p>Sharks. My kid wanted on the Sharks because that was the one team where the coach's kid didn't get special treatment - a novel idea, no? Nice to have an even playing field, no? And he liked the coach, because he treated him as an adult. Or at least an equal. Also a plus, because my kid had an opinion about where he wanted to go, and at least was able to talk about it. He didn't get what he wanted all the time, because he was too tall to play small, but at least the coach knew what was on his mind, and they talked. </p> <p>The coach was pretty good with the parents, which is more than half the problem with kid's sports, and he was organized. Maybe that's why he got good players...the parents felt good about leaving their kids in his hands. That was true for us, and we're really really difficult. </p> <p>Another observation: the coach was also pretty good about both weeding out bad apples and bringing on and giving good hearted kids a chance - and sometimes it worked out, sometimes not. Heck, they're just kids and we're just human. </p> <p>Basketball parents: sometimes, they can ruin a good kid, but most of the time, they develop their kid's skills. Still, there's something that happens in HS bball that can drive parents crazy. One SL parent said to after the SL/Punahou game that he was ready to lynch the SL coach...and that if Punahou had lost, those guys would be ready to lynch the Pun coach. True...sad, but true. But also, in the scheme of things, silly. Still, I'm guilty of going crazy. </p> <p>Now, IMHO, Hale got a lot out of the Pun team last year, in the sense that they made it as far as they did. The key was he gave the two stars a supporting cast. Now, one of those guys was a sophmore, and the other a freshman, but the five had it together, as you could see if you were at the 2nd Iolani game, and the one at St Louis - must-wins, and they won. Big time. Of course, the kids won the game (and the coaches lose them). </p> <p>This year, the team is uniformly much better across the board, but that's also a challenge, since they are proving harder to mesh, since there's no Miah or Spenser to point the way, and go. That said, Steinhoff is having a monster season, repeatedly finding ways to win. After being cut up less than 3 months ago. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-280 Wed, 16 Jan 2008 23:07:31 +0000 Fanatic 280@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>well said 69! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-279 Wed, 16 Jan 2008 22:41:06 +0000 bballfan69 279@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>I thought that we had this conversation a long time ago. Heres my take. tacon is a far better coach. Now dont get me wrong, he didnt win the title either, but like someone mentioned, Hale stepped into a championship team last year and lost. They had the best guard in da state and the most versatile big man in da state and lost. Plus I am still trying to figure out what hale is doing with some of his players. Anybody know why that makaula(? hope that is right) kid doesnt play. dat kid is a good player and hardly sees the floor. It looks like he favors Teo a little more, but the other kid is the better basketball player. Maybe Teo is just more physical, I dont know. Anyway back to the debate. Tacon took a Maonalua team that was not very good other than 2 players and almost beat Hale's team last year. And he has the team playing good again this year except I heard that austin has some leg injury so that might set them back. I saw them in the preseason and there is not much talent on the team outside of the 2 players, austin and I think its kure or something like that. I think that Tacon is not going to get outcoached very much if at all, but Hale has already proven that he can be outcoached by Grant in the state title game. I believe that Tacon's problem with winning at Pun. came from the outside interference that he had to put up with. If the parents and the school would have just shut up and let him coach, then I think that they would have got at least one title. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-276 Wed, 16 Jan 2008 21:29:06 +0000 Fanatic 276@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>jones and shaka, r u guys implying that superfan is the sharks coach??? thats a riot! i have seen them play before. i was never impressed with their team. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-258 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 15:43:22 +0000 Shaka 258@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Well here's my take on comparing Hale/Tacon. Hale walked into a situation last year where a championship team was already in place. just about everyone on this years team plus ostrokski and mcclachlin. too me, hale underacheived. Tacon inherited an oia team with not as many talented kids. Moanalua was able to beat kaimuki twice in the regular season last year. Punahou with a lot more talent (anyone want to argue this point?) lost to kaimuki. in fact, it looked like they didn't even show up. this year, Hale and Punahou already lost to a midget Iolani team. and i am not even going to bring up the lack of administrative responsibleness that the atheletic dept, school, and 1 set of parents are going to discuss with Hale...but you knew that already!!! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball/page/2#post-257 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 14:04:50 +0000 BBallSuperfan 257@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>ILHfan,</p> <p>I wanted to reserve judgement. A year and a half isn't enough time to say a coach is good or bad. But if you were to twist my arm and make me make a statement. I would say that Coach Hale is doing a pretty good job. I wouldn't say great but pretty dang good. With the two coaches changing jobs they both had to sell their coaching styles. That's always an up hill battle. But, I think they both did a pretty good job. Basing my opinion on the results of last season. Coach Hale's team did win the ILH championship and also took 2nd at state. They just lost to a hungier team. Don't know if coaching had a whole lot to do with it. Coach Tacon's team made it to state. Both great jobs with new teams. We'll really be able to pass judgement in the next couple of years. When both coaches have had a chance to develop their programs. </p> <p>As to your other point about one Coaches winning over a certain period of time. On all levels athletes and coaches are judged on wins and losses. In Pro Football the 1970s Vikings and 1990s Bills are still the punchline of many jokes. Like Rick Bobby said in the movie Talladega Nights "If you ain't first your last." Or here's another one "Second place is just the best of the losers." I'm not saying this is right, but this is how it is. We judge coaches on their success. That's why Doc is a Hawaii Basketball God and Coach Tacon is just a good coach. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-256 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 13:15:52 +0000 ILHfan 256@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>As for me, I really don't know yet. I think Tacon is a better coach than some give him credit for and as for Hale, its hard to tell with just a season and a half under his belt, so I'll reserve judgment until the end of February.</p> <p>From what I've seen over the last few years, Tacon appears to be a really good organizer... A very good "program builder". </p> <p>Hale seems as though he does a good job of "letting the kids play" without over-complicating things. Yeah, that kind of sounds like a back-handed comment, but its really not. I'm sure many of you have seen coaches "over-coach"... </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-255 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 10:54:23 +0000 ILHfan 255@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>BBallSuperfan - You can ask rhetorical questions and call someone a hater, but what do you think about Punahou's coaching situation? </p> <p>Please let us know... Do you think Hale is a better coach than Tacon? He does have one ILH Championship over Tacon, but does that make him better? </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-254 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 10:43:05 +0000 Shaka 254@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>darren,</p> <p>i'm not a hater...just a realist.</p> <p>how many coaches won states during tacon's tenure at punahou??? just one. it's not tacon's fault he didn't win...nobody else won!!!</p> <p>moanalua may have a lot of talent...but they dont have a lot of skills...specifically basketball skills!!! when you were busy playing coach of the year, i was watching tournaments...moanalua's personnel is subpar at best. also, austin blew his hamstring out 2 games ago...but i'm sure you knew that already.</p> <p>i dont have enough time to get into what makes a good coach...but a lot of it has to do with player development and a lot less time tooting your horn!</p> <p>know what i mean??? </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-253 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 10:38:19 +0000 BBallSuperfan 253@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Jones,</p> <p>Time will tell if Intermediate championships will translate to ILH and State Championships. Coach Hale and his staff have only been in place for 1 1/2 seasons.</p> <p>Give them a chance and don't be a hater! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-252 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 10:27:04 +0000 BBallSuperfan 252@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Shaka,</p> <p>how many championship (ILH or State) did Coach Tacon win at Punahou??</p> <p>Moanalua has a lot of talent this year but still has a lot of Losses in a so so division.</p> <p>What makes a good coach??</p> <p>You sound like a hater. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-251 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 10:06:12 +0000 Shaka 251@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>they dont equate to championships for a bunch of reasosns:</p> <p>1) parents who cant manage their expectations<br /> 2) boosters who donate obscen amounts of money telling coaches and administrators who should be playing and who shouldnt be<br /> 3) got rid of one of the best coaches in the state in Tacon<br /> 4) poor coaching</p> <p>i mean really, with all the talent that punahou has and they cant win a state championship...gimme a break!!! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-250 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 09:55:09 +0000 BasketballJones 250@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>Oh and by the way Auntie J, regarding your comments on these championships that the INTERMEDIATE teams win at Punahou. Congratulations! Question: Why doesn't these equate to state championships? Just wondering...Same players. Same program. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-249 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 09:52:15 +0000 BasketballJones 249@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>AuntieJ..I don't have a beef with Darrin. None at all. Matter of fact, we are pretty cordial with each other even after I tell him that I don't think that he is a good basketball coach. We usually have a good laugh after that though. Also, it looks like that other people here share the same sentiment as I do.</p> <p>Oh and by the way, he isn't a practicing attorney anymore. He sells insurance now. Apparently, better moeny. Go ahead and ask him. I did. Just before I told him that he isn't that good a coach. We both laughed after is said that. You should too. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-248 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 09:35:36 +0000 Shaka 248@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>mopitup...we're all bitching on this fourum anonymously!!! </p> <p>which one is your kid...iolani,punahou??? </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-244 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 08:29:39 +0000 Fanatic 244@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>winning championships 2 years in a row at the intermediate level at punahou with all the scholarship athletes that he recruits...yeah that's pretty impressive! </p> <p>brag to everyone about how he gets kids into punahou and 1 kid into Iolani...yeah, good character trait</p> <p>assemble the best available kids for club ball...and when that's not good enough, grab the best kids from other peoples teams...yeah, i see how its easy to confuse him with Mike Krzyzewski!!! </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-243 Mon, 14 Jan 2008 22:29:35 +0000 AuntieJ 243@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>BBall Jones - I dunno whatz youre beef with coach D but my nephew played for him at Punahou. His team won the ILH championship and went undefeated and I heard his team this year went undefeated again and won the ILH championshiop. </p> <p>When my nephew traveled to Vegas with Coach D they came in 2nd place and the older team that also went came in 3rd place. </p> <p>The mans also an attorney and spends so much time helping the kids so quit youre hatin. </p> http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/topic/mid-pacific-boys-basketball#post-242 Mon, 14 Jan 2008 21:22:54 +0000 bballfan69 242@http://www.hawaiihoops.com/forum/ <p>wow Jones. Beefing with somebody and its not me. This has got to be a mistake. I am staying out of this one. </p>