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Air Jordan or Black Mamba

  (41 posts)
  • Started 1 year ago by HoopFanatic
  • Latest reply from hoopwaiian

  1. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    I read in another post comparing Jordan and Bryant. While Kobe is an outstanding player and probably Top 10-20 all time, the debate isn't even close in my opinion.

    Maybe their games are somewhat similar. But Jordan's will was way stronger and his basketball IQ higher. Jordan never choked in the finals.

    Jordan elevated a once pathetic franchise. Before Jordan got to the Bulls, they were considered one of the worst, if not the worst NBA franchise ever. I don't think anyone remembers how bad the Bulls used to be. And Jordan was surrounded by so many bad players it was almost criminal.

    With guys like Dave Corzine and Sydney Green, Jordan led the once pathetic Bulls to the playoffs in his first year.

    True, both Kobe and Michael needed a secondary All-Star to win titles. But Micheal won with a pathetic team. Kobe couldn't get pass the first round with average teams.

    Kobe got spanked in several elimination games, often spending the 4th quarter on the bench since the games were decided by the 4th. Jordan never ever saw an elimination game in the finals nor ever lost a Championship Series.

    When Jordan's teams were favored and expected to win, they did.

    When Kobe's teams were favored and expected to win, they often lost. They put together a mini-dream team with Shaq, Malone, etc., in 2004 and they lost to an inferior talented team in the Pistons. They lost to the Celtics in 08, and they could lose to a borderline geriatric Celtics this year.

    So while Kobe is a great player and one of the best of all time, I can't see how a comparison can even be made.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  2. RooseveltCoach
    Member

    While I agree with you totally on the comparison, I wouldn't say that MJ won titles with a pathetic team. In my opinion, pippen was one of the top 5 players in the league at the time. He could score, rebound, pass, and I believe he was on the all NBA defensive team. Jordan is far better than Kobe but jordan did have a great player with him. But so did Kobe. I just wish Jordan would have only won 5 so that Barkley could have got that one. Jordan is selfish to deny his good friend a title. Haha

    Posted 1 year ago #
  3. brew
    Member

    On the same page with you HF!!!! No comparison!!!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  4. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    RC, I didn't mean that. Jordan won titles with solid teams. I am saying that he got pathetic teams to the opening round or 2nd round of the playoffs.

    Jordan took the Bulls from having the 3rd worst record in the NBA the previous season to making the playoffs. That is impressive.

    That is hard to due. It's completely different from Tim Duncan getting drafted by the Spurs when their record was terrible and making the playoffs the next year. They got the overall #1 pick since David Robinson was injured the previous season.

    When Jordan arrived, his team was fully intact and they were bad.

    Look at the guys he was surrounded by. Jud Buechler? Bill Wennington? Cliff Levingston? Luc Longley? Randy Brown?

    These role players are nowhere as good as Kobe's role players now. Yet Jordan got these guys to contribute in key games. Kobe doesn't know how to elevate the mediocre guys' game.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  5. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    Pound for Pound guys like Barkley, Rondo, and Rodman stand out for what they can do with their size limitations.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  6. menehunewater
    Member

    i agree that there is comparison with mj being smarter and achiving feats that kobe will not be able to duplicate. i was watching old mj games and the game and players have changed alot, guys are not all pumped up and they play defence. it really is hard to compare players from different eras from mikan to wilt to jabbar to magic to joradn to kobe/lebron to durant/rose/curry/jennings. is mj really a fair comparison to kobe we will really never know. one observation in mjs time the players were much more humble and didnt need to fist pump and dance everytime they did something, it just reflects on todays generation.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  7. RooseveltCoach
    Member

    My bad HF, I thought you meant his championship teams. You are right, he did play with some crappy teams. I see the same thing in Lebron more than Kobe. LeBron has taken some crappy teams to the playoffs. I think Kobe plays more like MJ than Lebron though. But they both make their teams better, but it would seem that Lebron does it in more of a positive way. Kobe carries his team more and Lebron uses his team more. But both make them better

    Posted 1 year ago #
  8. RooseveltCoach
    Member

    Jordan never cried like a bitch on every single play. If Kobe doesn't make it he cries to the refs, but never does he get the tech. At least Jordan just played the game. Did he get the calls? Yes and he knew it. Thats why he didnt cry when he didnt get one. Kobe thinks he should get EVERY call. While I do think he is the best player in the league, he has one of the worst attitudes in the league. He makes his team better, but enough of the crying.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  9. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    You are right, he complains too much. Just play the damn game. What does he have to complain about? He is super rich. His wife is hott! He can cheat on her ad she takes home back cuz he bought her a purple diamond. He should be quite happy!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  10. OldG
    Member

    @HF, would we expect more from high school graduates with tons of money? LOL. I wonder if Kobe whines, cries and stomps his feet when Vanessa tells him don't forget who his mommy really is!!!!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  11. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    HAHA!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  12. D12
    Member

    The bottom line in my opinion is that Kobe will go down as having a better career than Jordan, (numbers, scoring titles, stats, etc.)...

    However, we all know that Jordan is the better player. Kobe doesn't come close at all in my opinion.

    I don't even think Kobe is the best player in the NBA. I still think Lebron is. Everyone is going to be on me about this, but Kobe has a better team than Lebron does, I think that's clear. The Cavs have great regular season players, but Danny Ferry surrounded him with playoff no shows, (Mo Williams, Anderson Varejao, Delonte West, Jamario Moon, Antwan Jamison.)

    I think Lebron has better court vision, is a better rebounder, and a better athlete (stronger, quicker, faster, bigger.) Lebron still hasn't reached his full potential, that's what's scary about him.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  13. saynotodrugs
    Member

    It,s so tough for anyone to follow in jordans footsteps.But kobe probably comes the closest.Kobe consistently makes all nba and all first team defensive nba.As for lebron he has what probably no other skilled player has in the nba,and that's speed,strength,and of course being built like a linebacker.Imagine if jordan and kobe had that physical gift.Kobe still has shown that he's still the best in the world.Just an opinion.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  14. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    D12, Kobe has about 2 scoring titles. Jordan has 10. Jordan has either the highest or second highest PPG AVG in the playoffs. Jordan have 5 MVP's and 6 Finals MVP's. Kobe has 1 MVP and I think 1 Finals MVP.

    So you can't really say Kobe will have a better career. Jordan resurrected a franchise and took the NBA to new levels.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  15. Luna86
    Member

    @ HF
    Great points in comparing & contrasting the 2 individuals

    Yes ~ U gotta go with MJ...although Kobe is awesome and fun to watch,...in today's world the kids call it "sick!"
    If anything....Kobe (along with Lebron) has got to be the closest to MJ then anyone in the league at this time.

    @ menehune
    You also make some great points and opinions regarding the era's that these individuals played in as well as the "business like" attitude that they displayed "back in the day" when mikan, jabbar, wilt, jordan, I. Thomas, Gervin and Magic was in....nowadays it's a bit more (for a lack of a better word) ~ "flamboyant" and at times dis-respectful... (thugg like) at times it's like your watching "boys in the hood" lol
    ...after all, wasn't Gilbert Arenas (Washington Wizards) packing a "Nine Mill" in the locker room...OMG!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  16. hoopwaiian
    Member

    his airness. no comparison. aint over for mj either. possibility of adding on more rings as the owner of bobcats!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  17. OldG
    Member

    Good point coach....

    Posted 1 year ago #
  18. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    OLDG, which coach are you referring to?

    Posted 1 year ago #
  19. hoopwaiian
    Member

    there was "BE LIKE MIKE!" what about "PLAY FOR MIKE!" with free agents available july 1st ( and what a free agent market it is!) what if you got a call from HIS AIRNESS himself, to become a bobcat! would you take a cut in pay to play for mr. jordan? kobe will never reach this status.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  20. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    When Jordan was in charge of Washington, no one really wanted to go to Washington. Now he's in charge of Charlotte which isn't a more attractive city than Washington D.C. I can't see them getting a "huge" free agent. Plus they don't enough money under the current salary cap to get a Max Contract Free Agent. Plus they can't afford the luxury tax either.

    Posted 1 year ago #
  21. OldG
    Member

    HF~ the coach reference was towards Hoopawaiian...though it can really be towards anyone on Hawaii Hoops during this time of year.

    Jordan as a player is untouchable. But as an owner or GM or whatever he still needs to hit his shot on that one. What was #1 pick for the bullets....the kid outta high school? You know the one who went to the Lakers? Rhymes with Salami......Kwame Brown....

    Posted 1 year ago #
  22. HoopFanatic
    Veteran

    I would be Kwame Brown. He is a rich man! Who cares if he is a below-average player. Hell he has over 30 millions dollars and gets the best seat in the house every night!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  23. hoopwaiian
    Member

    i would be kalani brown TOO, for 30 MIL.!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  24. hoopwaiian
    Member

    would "LOVE" ( heavy emphasis!! ) to see number 23 play for number 23!!!!!

    Posted 1 year ago #
  25. OldG
    Member

    Got me on that one! 30 Million in the BANK.

    Posted 1 year ago #

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